♠ Plato´s “Republic”: “The Allegory of the Cave and the Analogy of the Divided Line”:
Plato (427/347 BCE).-
________________________________________________________________________________________________
Plato’s Allegory of the Cave is written as a dialogue between Plato’s teacher Socrates and Plato’s brother Glaucon at the beginning of “The Republic” Book VII (514a–520a). This allegory is presented after the analogy of the sun (507b–509c) and the analogy of the divided line (509d–513e).
In the allegory, Plato likens people untutored in the Theory of Forms to prisoners chained in a cave, unable to turn their heads. All they can see is the wall of the cave. Behind them burns a fire. Between the fire and the prisoners there is a parapet, along which puppeteers can walk. The puppeteers, who are behind the prisoners, hold up puppets that cast shadows on the wall of the cave. The puppeteers are just people outside the cave walk along this walkway, who presumably carry things on their heads including; animals, plants, wood and stone.
____________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Here is an illustration based on the whole description of the Cave:
Plato´s Allegory of the Cave.-
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________
►Description: “The Allegory of the Cave”:
►The prisoners, the cave and the shadows:
The prisoners are unable to see these puppets, the real objects, that pass behind them.
What the prisoners see and hear are shadows and echoes cast by objects that they do not see. Here is an illustration of Plato’s Cave.
Such prisoners wou ld mistake appearance for reality. As they had never seen the real objects ever before, they believe that the shadows of objects are real objects.
► The Game:
Plato suggests that the prisoners would begin a ‘game’ of guessing which shadow would appear next. If one of the prisoners were to correctly guess, the others would praise him as the most clever.
►Departure:
One of the prisoners then escapes from their bindings and leaves the cave. He is shocked at the world he notices outside the cave and does not believe it can be real. As he becomes used to his new surroundings, he realizes that his former view of reality was wrong. He begins to understand this world. He is first able to see only shadows of things. Next he can see the reflections of things in water and later is able to see things themselves. He is then able to look at the stars and moon by night and finally he is able to look upon the sun. Finally, he is able to behold the sun, which is the main source of knowledge.
►Return to the Cave:
The prisoner returns to the cave, to inform the other prisoners of his findings. They do not believe him and threaten to kill him if he tries to set them free.
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________
►Video: “The Allegory of the Cave”:
Video: The Allegory of the Cave (Animated). Click on the image above to watch it at YouTube.-
_________________________________________________________________________________________________
►The Allegory of the Cave: Symbolism and General Meaning:
The escaped prisoner represents the Philosopher, who seeks knowledge outside of the cave and outside of the senses.
The Sun represents philosophical truth and knowledge.
The prisoner´s intellectual journey represents a philosopher´s journey when finding truth and wisdom.
In this sense, the Allegory of the Cave is an attempt to explain the philosopher’s place in society
The other prisoners reaction to the escapee returning represents that people are scared of knowing philosophical truths and do not trust philosophers.
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________
The analogy of the Sun (Excerpt of Plato´s “Republic”).-
____________________________________________________________________________________________________________
► “The Allegory of the Cave and the Analogy of the divided line”:
A & B: THE PHYSICAL WORLD: “APPEARANCE”
Thus A represents shadows and reflections of physical things, and B the physical things themselves. These correspond to two kinds of knowledge, the illusion (εἰκασία eikasia) of our ordinary, everyday experience, and belief (πίστις pistis) about discrete physical objects which cast their shadows.
→Method to achieve knowledge: In A, the eye makes guesses upon observing likenesses of visible things.
→Method to achieve knowledge: In B, the eye makes probable predictions upon observing visible things
A & B: The Visible World in The Allegory of the Cave
A: BOUND REAR OF CAVE. SHADOWS PROJECTIONS. (SHADOWS, REFLECTIONS, ETC).
B: UNBOUND: FIGURES PROJECTING SHADOWS. (OBJECTS/THINGS).
C & D: THE “INTELLIGIBLE WORLD” (FORMS/IDEAI): “REALITY”
C involves mathematical reasoning (διάνοια dianoia). There abstract mathematical objects such as geometric lines are discussed. Such objects are outside the physical world (and are not to be confused with the drawings of those lines, which fall within the physical world B).
→Method to achieve knowledge: In C, the Psyche assumes hypotheses while making use of likenesses, always moving towards final conclusions.
D includes the subjects of philosophical understanding (νόησις noesis).
→In D, knowledge is achieved by the method of dialectic, “using the hypotheses not as first principles, but only as hypotheses — that is to say, as steps and points of departure into a world which is above hypotheses, in order that she may soar beyond them to the first principle of the whole” (511b)
C & D: The Intelligible World in The Allegory of the Cave:
C: OUTSIDE AND DAZZLED BY THE SUNSHINE, THE PRISONER SEES ONLY SHADOWS (LOWER FORMS)
D: ADJUSTED TO BRIGHT SUNLIGHT, THE PRISONER PERCEIVES VISIBLE OBJECTS AND APPREHENDS THE SUN (HIGHER FORMS).
________________________________________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________________________________
►The Allegory of the Cave, The Analogies of the Divided line and the Sun & the Theory of Forms:
The Allegory of the Cave, The analogy of the divided line and the analogy of the Sun are related to Plato’s Theory of Forms, according to which the “Forms” (or “Ideas“), and not the material world of change known to us through sensation, possess the highest and most fundamental kind of reality.
Only knowledge of the Forms constitutes real knowledge.
For Plato’s Forms are not mental entities, nor even mind-dependent. They are independently existing entities whose existence and nature are graspable only by the mind, even though they do not depend on being so grasped in order to exist.
The dialogue “Phaedo” contains an extended description of the characteristics and functions of the forms:
•Unchangeable (78c10-d9).
•Eternal (79d2)
•Intelligible, not perceptible (79a1-5)
•Divine (80a3, b1)
•Incorporeal (passim)
•Causes of being (“The one over the many”) (100c)
Are unqualifiedly what their instances are only with qualification (75b)
Other dialogues fill out the picture: •non-temporal (“Timaeus” 37e-38a); •non-spatial (“Phaedrus” 247c); •they do not become, they simply are (“Timaeus” 27d3-28a3).
________________________________________________________________________________________________
Plato (427/347 BCE).-
________________________________________________________________________________________________________
►Links Post:
http://faculty.washington.edu/smcohen/320/thforms.htm
http://faculty.washington.edu/smcohen/320/cave.htm
https://aquileana.wordpress.com/2007/07/29/32/
Aquileana
⚡️La Audacia de Aquiles⚡️ 
Thanks @HernandoDelaRos for sharing this post at Twitter,
Aquileana 😛
Thanks @DGMARYOGA for sharing this post at Twitter, Aquileana 🙂
Excelente entrada Aquileana. Yo estudié el tema de la teoría de las Ideas de Platón hace años ya y tu post me hizo recordar aquellas lecciones, quizás un poco básicas, de Filosofía. La Idea del sol del conocimiento siempre me pareció magnífica.
Thanks @linneatanner for sharing this post at Twitter, Aquileana 🙂
Gracias Sara… Yo estudié inicialmente el tema con el libro de Carpio, en secundaria.
Me alegro de que haya gustado el post, Aquileana 🙂
Very interesting post . You make difficult things easier to me. Thank you.
Thanks @Maxima003 for sharing this post at Twitter, Aquileana 🙂
https://twitter.com/Maxima003/status/452110366781091840
Thanks for dropping by… Best wishes, M, Aquileana 🙂
One of my Favorite parts of the Republic… Nice post and thank you for sharing it:)
Thanks Joe … Good choice…
I have always loved the allegory and the analogies of Sun and the Divided Line.
Best wishes and happy weekend for you Aquileana 🙂
I’ve been browsing on-line greater than 3 hours these days, but I by no means discovered any attention-grabbing write-up like yours. It’s rather price sufficient for me. Personally, if all internet site owners and bloggers produced good content material as you did, the net will most likely be a lot extra handy than ever before.
Thanks for dropping by and commenting…
Best regards, Aquileana 🙂
Okay, I’ve read this once and have to re read to better digest.
The idea of imagination as base and intelligence/knowledge at the zenith is interesting.
Peace,
Eric
Hello Eric… Yes I have also found particularly interesting the divided line and the types of knowledge as well as the method to achieve it according to each segment of the line. Thanks for dropping by… Best wishes, Aquileana 🙂
this is beautifully written and illustrated.
Thank you Mr muscleHead… It is a pleasure to read your comment, best wishes, Aquileana 🙂
Siempre me sorprende, por errónea que pueda ser la conclusión final de estos pensadores, la capacidad de ponerse a pensar y extraer conclusiones de lo que observan.
Salvela -Josep,
Coincido, son pilares del pensamiento filosófico de todos los tiempos y sus razonamientos y deducciones son implacables al margen de que compartamos o no su perspectivas epistemológicas.
Muchos saludos, con afecto, Aquileana 🙂
Plato was certainly creative to even come up with such a useful allegory to show the role of the philosopher in the world. Sometimes I want to go hide in a cave, away from the world, but that’s just me 🙂
Maybe for another post you could expand on Phaedo and the concept of the immortal soul. Plato has so much to make us ponder, so long after he has passed. That’s the sign of a classic philosopher!
Thank-you for another intellectual, well-written post, dear Aqui!
Hugs from Plato and I (I’m sure he would agree so I spoke for him),
Love Chris xo
Thanks @christybis for sharing this post at Twitter, Aquileana 🙂
Thanks Christy Birmingham for sharing this post at Google Plus,
Aquileana 😛
Your comments back to me are beautiful, Aqui! Thank-you for all of the hope and love you provide to my life xo
Hi Chris..
Thanks for dropping by and commenting . I’ll keep in mind your suggestions as regard to Plato’s Phaedo, the inmortality of the soul AND the theory of forms… good advice !!!…
I am really glad to know that you liked the post,
As ever, it is my pleasure to read your comments,
Hugs & Best wishes, Aquileana 😛
Dear Aquileana,you have so brilliantly presented one of the most significant parts of Republic. You have employed the simple myth of the Cave for the better understanding of the Actual World !Oftentimes simplicity unveils big truths and as A.Einstein used to say :
“If you can’t explain it to a six year old, you don’t understand it yourself.”
Great work,I gladly tweet it away. Have an enjoyable and creative weekend
Doda 🙂
DG Maryoga,
Thanks for the great comment… That quote by Einstein is marvellous, and so true!!!.. You are right a regrad to the myth of the Cave… As a matter of fact some people link it to the movie Matrix, did you know that?…
Bets wishes and thanks for your support, Aquileana 🙂
Yes,Aquileana,I know that and in a way I find it an interestng analogy with some logic behind it.Matrix world is also illusionary.Isn’t it ? A good question mark,I suppose.We have to break the codes that impede free thinking … We have to see reality by ourselves and stop seeing only shadows.The virtual world in Matrix is only reflective,it’s a shadow in its form … I find plenty of reasons to refer to similar situations … Oh,Gosh,knowledge is power and transforms the way we view the world … Plain truth is behind the invisible …
Enough of my rambling,they are issues we can talk non-stop …
Thank you Aquileana,your post is a stimulus to our imagination …
Warm Greetings from Greece,loved the Greek words you included in your post in order to go deeper into the meaning of some words… 🙂
“The Matrix” modernizes the original allegory and adds a more humanistic appeal.
Hello Doda…
I have found avery intersting post.
Check it out as it is really worth reading:
http://aphilosophersjourney.wordpress.com/2012/11/09/the-matrix-vs-the-allegory-of-the-cave/
You are right when you say that there are similarities between the movie Matrix and the Allegory of the cave…
>Neo could be related to the prisoner who escapes from the cave
>They both share a similar story about the epistemological unreliability of the senses and the need to abstract from the senses in order to gain knowledge.
>The differences include the fact that the Matrix has no forms while the Allegory of the Cave does.
Thanks for your great comment sending you my best wishes, enjoy your weekend,
Aquileana 🙂
You made this sound so simple,bless you for that.but what happens when others think their own philosophical view is more valid than somebody else’s?xx Rachel
Hi Speedy And Rachel.
Good point… we tend to think as … thus sometimes we miss our own personal perspective towards certain topics.
We must keep in mind that we are all unique human beings and also consider that the circumstances and surrounding define us.
There are no higher thoughts nor better ideas at the end…
Best wishes to both of you, Aquileana 🙂
I remember this from phil class in uni. I really liked it…thanks for sharing the vid. 🙂
Hello Kev,
Great to know… Those are the kind of classes we wouldn’t forget easily, don’ t you think?…
Cheers and thank you, Aquileana 😛
Definitely. However, a lot of your posts serve to refresh my memory and some. You have a lot to offer and go far beyond the quotation of a textbook. 🙂 I enjoy reading your posts.
Thanks for your words, Kev… I truly appreciated them..
Enjoy your weekend, best regards Aquileana 😛
Thanks @linneatanner for sharing this pin from Plato’s post at Twitter. Aquileana 😛
I just wanted to stop by and say thanks for following my blog. I hope I write some interesting articles for you! 🙂
Thanks Lisa… It is my pleasure to stop by your blog… Good to connect, best wishes, Aquileana 🙂
Thanks @8nja for sharing this post at Twitter,
Aquileana 🙂
…”Only knowledge of the Forms constitutes real knowledge. For Plato’s Forms are not mental entities, nor even mind-dependent. They are independently existing entities whose existence and nature are graspable only by the mind, even though they do not depend on being so grasped in order to exist…”
I love these lines, Aquileana, as they illuminate the goal of Plato, and his fellow philosophers’ search, in their quest for “real knowledge.”
I think these “forms” correspond, in my mind anyway, to the “laws” of nature: gravity, relativity, etc, the laws of physics, which form the framework of life in the universe. What do you think?
The laws of nature do seem to match the extended list from phaedo:
Unchangeable (78c10-d9),
•Eternal (79d2)
•Intelligible, not perceptible (79a1-5)
•Divine (80a3, b1)
•Incorporeal (passim)
•Causes of being (“The one over the many”) (100c)
Excellent post, as always, and so enjoyable to churn our brains with such productive thinking! xoxoxo ;^)
Hello there dear Aisha,
Thank you for the thoughtful comment…
Before replying I wanted to ask you where I am supposed to leave a comment as regrad to Achilles’ shield… Can I do it in you Oasis at wordpress… RSVP !
As to your idea tending to lik Plato’s “forms” to the “laws” of nature (IE gravity, relativity, etc, the laws of physics, which form the framework of life in the universe) it is truly interesting an eloquent.
However as far as I know Plato was meaning to define the Abstract or universal idea beneath all the particular entities,.. Ideas or Forms could be then related to the idea of Genre being the entities species.
If we say that something is Just it is because it takes part of the Form of Justice with all the just entities.
And the same applies to the Idea of Tree, Man, Friendship, etc.. Those forms are divine and if we recognize two things as being beautiful thus as being involved with the idea of Beauty it is because we have the footprints of the ideas in our minds, we just recognize them as our soul is inmortal and has already been in touch with those ethereal Froms… For Plato, speaking through the voice of Socrates: “To learn is to remember”, and what we remember is the archetype of the Ideas we have already known..
Best wishes & hugs, Aquileana 😛
Oh, Aquileana, I really like your clarification on the forms, this is very easy to understand and also easy to touch… very wonderful, so it seems like characteristics are forms or perhaps we can say ideals are forms? This is quite interesting, when we understand the way the ancient Greeks deified characteristics, eg Athena represents wisdom, etc.
About my shield of achilles, I would love your response anywhere convenient for you. If you like on my shield website, there’s a place for guest comments at: http://meieus.com/achillesshield/ASBlog.html
Just scroll to the bottom of the page to find the button to press for leaving a comment.
xoxo ;^)
Hi Aisha,
You asked above:
"So it seems like characteristics are forms or perhaps we can say ideals are forms? "
My answer will tend to emphasize the second option (Ie "Ideals are forms")
Good to know then. I'll visit you at night or tomorrow to comment there at Achille's shield.
Best wishes my dear friend, Aquileana 😛
PS-Update; I have already read and left you a comment at your site,great post!.. best wishes, Aquileana.
Thank you dear Aquileana for the wonderful comment on my website, I’m slowly working on converting it to a blog, but there’s a huge amount of content and lots of programming to make it all tie together properly. I’m excited to make it a blog tho, as it will be much easier to share and keep updated! Stay tuned at http://achillesshieldblog.wordpress.com
♥♥♥ ;^)
Dear Aisha,
Sure, I’ll stay tunned and can’t wait to see the new layout..
I wish you the best with Achilles’ shield.
Have a great week ahead, Aquileana 😛
Thanks @AishasOasis for sharing this post at Twitter,
Aquileana 🙂
Another enlightening post! Love the symbolism of the cave. It shows up in so much myth as well. Very intriguing.
Thanks Kourt…
I am really glad to know that you enjoyed the post…
I agree with you, the symbolism of the cavern is truly prolific and rich.
Best wishes, xo, Aquileana 😛
It’s funny how there is a universality to the cave. As an author, I’m fascinated by what we see reappearing in books especially across the ages and cultures. 🙂
Happy sunday Kourtney.
Right!!!.. Well now that you mention it…
As an universal allegory it might be a sort of collective archetype.
Hugs Aquileana 🙂
Sight is such a deceptive sense, small tricks, let alone large ones can deceive the mind when cognitive thought is not pressed to endeavour a more balanced resolve to explore. Our vision/sight has always lied to humanity the most, but if we separate out each one of the senses, we’ll be like to find they will each lie in isolation also. Is this why so few of us are willing to explore beyond the closed worlds we live in most of our lives, to avoid going out beyond our self imposed calculated isolation. Enjoyed the reading, Aquileana. It took a couple of times to sift through the elements, and varied aspects explored. Cheers.
Thanks Sean for you thoughtful comment here… I agree with you when you say that “vision/sight has always lied to humanity the most”… Do senses deceive us?… Somehow they do. However as you have also held it would be hard and isolating to us to keep it up without them..
Best regards and have a good week ahead, Aquileana 😛
Best to you, Aquileana. Have a good week too 🙂
I can’t remember where I first encountered this. It was either in Philosophy 101 or in an American Literature class in relation to reading Thoreau and Emerson. How we see and perceive the world depends on so many factors 🙂 Tennyson’s poem “The Lady of Shalott” plays with some of the allegorical aspects of this as well, though I’m sure many other pieces do, but that is the one I’m most familiar with.
Jeri, First of all, thanks for dropping!. Secondly I didn’t know Tennyson’s poem and probably wouldn’t know it still either if not for your mention.
It is really beautiful ode of a lady whose trip end with death as
“She floated down to Camelot”. “The Lady of Shalott” story in Tennyson poem made me think of Ophelia’s suicide in “Hamlet”… And I can see why you held that there are some symbolical aspects that could be related to Plato’s allegory.
And by that I mean, mainly, the spooky imaginary of shadows, death and night. That is watery and nightly appearances
I found that parts II and IV are absolutely eloquent and rich as regard to allegorical images that blend the phenomenology of being apparently
I am adding from some allegorical examples below, taken from these two parts of Tennyson’s poem .
Best wishes to you and thanks for your comment, Aquileana 😛
Part II (Stanza 2)
And moving through a mirror clear
That hangs before her all the year,
Shadows of the world appear.
Part II (Stanza 3)
And sometimes through the mirror blue
The knights come riding two and two:
Part IV (Stanza 5)
“I am half sick of shadows,” said
The Lady of Shalott.
Under tower and balcony,
By garden-wall and gallery,
A gleaming shape she floated by,
Part IV (Stanza 6)
Who is this? and what is here?
And in the lighted palace near
Died the sound of royal cheer;
Links
“The Lady of Shalott” by Alfred Lord Tennyson (1809-1892)
http://www.victorianweb.org/authors/tennyson/los1.html
“La dama de Shalott de Alfred Tennyson (1809-1892)
http://elespejogotico.blogspot.com.ar/2011/07/dama-shalott-alfred-tennyson.html
Part II (Stanza 2)
There she weaves by night and day
A magic web with colours gay.
She has heard a whisper say,
A curse is on her if she stay
To look down to Camelot.
She knows not what the curse may be,
And so she weaveth steadily,
And little other care hath she,
The Lady of Shalott.
Once she sees the stud Lancelot, she can never live in a world of pale artistic imitation. As an artist, she had remained distant from society up until that point. Venturing out into the real world doesn’t go so well for her, or does it?
It”s also been adapted into a song by Loreena McKennitt.
Hi Jeri Thanks for the last comment.. I understand that her way of being might be related with a sort of stoical way of being. Romanticism tends to emphasize the features of the artist as a melancholic person, who likes to be, as Thomas Hardy would say, “far from the madding crowd”…
As to the song by Loreena McKennitt.I have found the video and it is truly touching and beautiful (sigh). Thank you very much for telling me about it.
All the best for you, Jeri,
Aquileana 😛
Thanks @JeriWB for sharing this post at Twitter, Aquileana 🙂
I love the statue of Plato at the beginning of the post, it makes me want to reach out and touch his face. SD
Hi Sandra… Now that you mention it , I want to do the same !.
Best regrads and thanks for dropping by, Aquileana 🙂
🙂 SD
Thanks @MikeMcGuire_ for sharing this post at Twitter, Aquileana 😛
I love your brilliant analysis of history and your sharing of it to help others dissect it. xo Always happy to share your brilliant mind!
Hello there D.G, happy monday!.
Thanks for dropping by to read and comment .
Your words mean a lot to me and I really appreciated them (=you!)…
Best regards, Aquileana 😛
Thanks @pokercubster for sharing this post at Twitter,
Aquileana 🙂
As great as he is, and an amazingly “christian” pagan, he has saddled western though with “universals” and alas there are none. Having said that I would rather the Socratic peripatetic than any other method
Well pointed Carl… A very witty comment. Plato set down the “universal” and later on Aristotle incorporated the idea of a First uncaused efficient cause, which would be related to the idea of God later on, during the Middle Age.
I guess that the analogy of the Sun in Plato’s allegory of the cave could be eloquent in this same sense.
Best wishes and thanks for dropping by to read and comment, Aquileana 😛
Qué buenos repasos a la Filosofía…
Voy a decir algo que leí -no sé dónde- y me parece muy bueno: que por fin se ha hecho realidad la caverna de Platón, gracias a la televisión y el cine: a través de ellos, vemos como en sombras la realidad que nos circunda, y es precisamente a través de las representaciones sociales que se transmiten en los medios como nos hacemos una idea de las cosas, y se difunde una visión más o menos hegemónica -esto es Gramsci, seguro que te suena- de la realidad. Por una parte, es o son imprescindibles. Por otra, hace falta ahora más que nunca el papel del filósofo, del intelectual, que llame la atención sobre lo verdaderamente importante.
Gracias por la oportunidad.
Hola Chestersoc,
Excelentes reflexiones sobre la realidad virtual que literalmente recubre con sus velos de Maya nuestra supuesta real realidad … El tema es poder delinear los límites y entender que en algunos casos no existe una separación tajante, sino más bien una superposición de fronteras de estos diferentes espacios que tiende a ser permeable.
En cuanto a tu aporte en relación al concepto de hegemonía en Gramcsi y el rol comprometido del intelectual como agente activo del cambio, coincido totalmente con vos.
Muchos saludos y gracias por tus grandes palabras, Aquileana 😛
Es verdad lo de la superposición de fronteras y capas, y más en un mundo tan complejo como el nuestro. Pero el horizonte de lo verdadero -si quiera como horizonte- está dan difuminado hoy…
Volvemos casi a la conversación del chestertonblog sobre los quijotes.
Por cierto, tiene su encanto mantener esta conversación doble que acaba confluyendo.
Adelante con esta labor del pensamiento.
Chestersoc,
Sin duda que se está difuminando las fronteras entre lo Real y lo Virtual (No Real). Y entre ambos espacios se proceso un proceso de difusión porque los límites son relativamente permeables.
Es verdad que Cervantes, El Quijote y Chesterton bien pueden ser mencionados aquí. El Quijote y sus molinos muy pertinentemente, por cierto.
Muchas gracias por el comentario. Saludos, con afecto, Aquileana 😛
I feel so out of place here, Aquileana, for your knowledge is far beyond what I know. What an indepth article, and I must admit, beyond what I know or understand. What an intellect! And you speak other languages. I am just a tad overwhelmed, for my brain does not function as yours does. But I stopped by to see what you are all about and to say “Hi” hope all is well in your life. Love, Amy
Amy.. You are so marvellous my dear, thanks for your beautfil words, I truly love your poems so saying hi too and just going to check out your blog in a while.
Best wishes, xo, Aquileana 😛
Aw, Aquilleana, I am really touched. (((HUGS))) Amy
Hugs right back at you Amy, Thank you, Aquileana 😛
(smile)
i’d not come across this before – this is fascinating!
Thanks a lot for dropping by and commenting… I am really glad that you enjoyed this topic, Freya.
Best wishes, Aquileana 😛
Aquileana, i was intrigued by how the cave dwellers wanted to kill the one who had uncovered the truth. Humans have always resisted having someone else open their eyes whether it’s about addictions, philosophy, or spirituality. It’s sad how sometimes even a person in an abusive situation will treat someone who is trying to intervene as an enemy–the real enemy is fear and denial. Anyways, this is the path my thoughts took as I read this interesting post.
Blessings ~ Wendy ❀
Hello Wendy , thanks a lot for your comment..
I think you have highlighted an interesting point here, which is something that might not have caught my attention at first sight… But now that you mention it I see its relevance and meaning… It is great to read your musings and I truly appreciate your approach as regard to this topic.
Best wishes, Aquileana 🙂
Philosophy tends to go right over my head. I hope that my comments, though from left field, are at least engaging. 😉 Reading your posts will be an education for me in an area of study I have neglected..
Thanks Wendy. Reading your poetry is an enlightening experience… I have just dropped by your site a while ago and I left you a comment in “Forever Love” , which I truly enjoyed by the way…
Best wishes, Aquileana 😛
Thank you for your kindness. ❀
Plato certainly saw the world and our place in it from a different perspective. I was intrigued by the diagram you posted with the objects and state of minds. Makes me wonder whether imagination is greater than knowledge or the other way around. Without imagination one cannot invent, create or analyse. So which is more profound?
I do enjoy reading your posts Aquileana. They make me think beyond the context of the words.
ciao
Luciana 😀
Thanks @ClucianaLuciana for sharing this post at twitter,
Aquileana 🙂
Hello Luciana,
You have highlighted an important point here…
Even though Plato places it in the lower level of the divided line, imagination is important, Knowledge approach is progressive, going from the lower types of knowledge to the higher ones (meaning from Imagination to Intelligence). In Plato’s theory of recollection (“To learn is to remember”), mainly developed in his dialogue “Meno”, thes epoints are analyzed in depth.
Thanks a lot for stopping by to read and comment.
Best wishes, Aquileana 🙂
Hello Aquileana,I thought I would answer you question about bunnies and cats and the answer is yes they can get along well together though you will get a little tension once a bunny gets to puberty which is around 16 weeks at that time the bunny will try to mate with the cat so will follow and chase after the cat that is when the bunny needs to be neutered or spayed and after a couple of weeks this will settle down.the trick is to introduce them for short periods of supervised time just to make sure that the cat understands the bunny is not prey and is a family member and gradually increase the time that they socialise together,they should bond well or tolerate each other after a few weeks.if you get a bunny from a shelter they are normal neutered or spayed be for you get them home so this will avoid the puberty problems.this can still be avoided if you know the age of the bunny so that you can get it neutered or spayed at around 14 to 15 weeks old.My first Bunny I had lived well with 2 cats and a dog,he turned out to b quite a tough boy as he used to chase strange cats out of the garden,hope this helps,best wishes xx Rachel
Hi Sppedy…
Thanks for taking the time to answer here in such a thorough way…
Very interesting particularly the little trick as regard to introduce them for short periods of supervised time and to be aware of puberty problems… To summarize, the easier option would be to get an bunny which has been already neutered and spayed, right?,
I have two cats (a male and a female, both neutered) and I absolutely love bunnies. Maybe one of these days I’ll get one then.
Best wishes, Rachel & Speedy, Aquileana 😛
Yes a bunny that has been neutered or spayed is easier,you will find that young bunny that has recently been neutered or spayed will be easier to introduce as they have no fear,and certain breed are braver and more curious than others,Rexes are very chilled and play full in temperment,nothing phases them at all,lops are similar but can be a bit feisty and grumpy at times and from my experience Dutches are more cautious and can be a bit aggressive at first they do come around but it takes time my last bunny was a Dutch and it took a couple of years for him to be really friendly where as my first bunny he was a lop was friendly from the start and more brave and up for anything as is Speedy but he is more relaxed about things but that is because he is a Rex.hope this helps,if you want to know anything else let me know,xx Rachel
You are rexes and you are lovely. If I ever get a rabbit it will be a REx then…
Thanks a lot for taking the time to clarify this for me and for providing me this useful information.
Many hugs to Rachel and to Speedy from Aquileana 🙂
you’re welcome,xx
Happy weekend to Rachel and Speedy ❤ .
Aquileana 😛
The Allegory of the Cave was presented at my first lecture at university – I’ve called on it ever since in real life in order to make sense of the reactions of others when presenting any new idea.
It’s good to read such an in depth and comprehensive explanation 🙂
Thank you, too, for dropping by my blog and your lovely comment.
Kittykatmandoo…
Thanks for your kind words. I find the way you have called to the allegory of the cave is very clever and provoking.
It was my pleasure to read your blog. Thanks for doing the same.
I wish you all the best, Aquileana 🙂
I think I may need to re read twice to digest it.. But on my first impression its suggesting we think outside of the box? but outside of the box there is often no premise to base our thinking on, So we guess at it? and come to conclusions.. and if the guess should be right we are then thought of as being quite something!..
Our imagination is something too which is often thinking outside the box?cave.
I really am struggling with this one Aquileana, I think I am stuck in some Cave somewhere! 😉 xxx Your mind is boggling.. 🙂
Have a great weekend my sweet friend xxx Sue
Sue…
The box> It is a good metaphor.. Even thouugh imagination and thinking are two types of knowlegde which are kept “inside the box” (cave).
As the prisoner (chosen one, which symbolizes the clever one among his mates , (therefore the philosopher, goes outside the box cave) the types of knowledge involved are > Firstly:thinking and secondly> intelligence.
Inside the cave > Imagination and Belief
The knowledge inside the cave represents shadows and reflections of physical things, and the physical things themselves. These correspond to two kinds of knowledge, the illusion or imagination of our ordinary, everyday experience… and the belief about discrete physical objects which cast their shadows.
Outside the cave>
Thinking> involves mathematical reasoning (διάνοια dianoia). There abstract mathematical objects such as geometric lines are discussed. Such objects are outside the physical world
Intelligence>includes the subjects of philosophical understanding, which are the Abstract Ideas for Plato.
Ideas and intelligence are related to the idea of Genre being the entities species.
If we say that something is Just it is because it takes part of the Form of Justice with all the just entities.
And the same applies to the Idea of Tree, Man, Friendship, etc.. Those forms are divine and if we recognize two things as being beautiful thus as being involved with the idea of Beauty it is because we have the footprints of the ideas in our minds, we just recognize them as our soul is inmortal and has already been in touch with those ethereal Froms… For Plato, speaking through the voice of Socrates: “To learn is to remember”, and what we remember is the archetype of the Ideas we have already known…
Thanks a lot for taking tiem to reda and comment all my best wishes and hugs to you,
Aquileana 🙂
My Dear Aquileana, Its so wonderful to read your in-depth reply, and now you have explained as you have I am beaming from ear to ear.. as I now ‘get it’ and you make it so simple .. I so admire your young mind and how you are delving into these ancient teachers..
We are only now waking up to what we already have known… And its so much FUN as I wake up even more to these ancient teachers you bring to life again within your posts..
I am learning so much from your amazing posts.. THANK YOU! Dear One.. 🙂 Have a wonderful weekend break.. and Enjoy 🙂
Love Sue xox
My dear Sue,
After reading your comment I am now the one who is beaming from ear to ear. 😛
You are right not only we still have a long path ahead in regrad to knowledge (therefore remembering what we already know) but this reminiscence process is also continuous and progressive… Thus, we wake up many times…
Thanks for such a beautiful comment. I hope you have an ace rest of the weekend.
Love xo,
Aquileana 🙂
I will now, Work finished… and several days of blissful time out.. 🙂 and it makes me also beam to know I made you Beam… 🙂 xxx
Thank You for the beautiful words, dear Sue. I am Wishing You a great weekend ahead…
Best regards and hugs as I am smiling at You again, Aquileana 😉
🙂 🙂 😀 xxxx
Hi Aquileana,
After a long absence I’m back to get invaluable instruction on your blog. I must admit that my somewhat calcified brain cells are struggling with these philosophical intricacies, so I’ll just keep in mind the basics that according to Plato Ideas exist independent of objects, if my conclusion is correct. And that philosophers with their higher understanding of our universe would be the best people to run the state.
Correct me if my conclusions are wrong, I’m always ready to learn more.
Cheers, 🙂 Irina
Thanks @kookadim for sharing this post at Twitter, Aquileana 🙂
Thanks +Irina Dimitric for sharing this post at Google Plus,
Aquileana 😛
Hello dear Irina.
Great to read your insights here, thanks for dropping by to read and comment.
As to your conclusions, there are both correct.
1) according to Plato Ideas exist independent of objects
They do.. But I d love to point out something though> Even though Plato highlighted in his dialogue Phaedo that Ideas (or Forms) are Intelligible, not perceptible, the way we have to remember those Forms is by physical contact in the real world (menaing factually, through the senses). That is how we remember the Incorporeal Ideas, as they both, independent but related to objects…
Plato would further develop this subject particularly in his dialogues Meno, Phaedo and throughout Phaedrus .
A note in advance: As regard to the dialogue Phaedrus it will be subject of my next post…
2) philosophers with their higher understanding of our universe would be the best people to run the state.
That is what Plato believed. Correct. He was quite elitist in this sense. He was particularly held these ideas in “The Republic”.
Best wishes and I hope you have a wonderful sunday and week ahead, Aquileana 🙂
Thanks @12C_and_Skiving for sharing this post at Twitter,
Aquileana 🙂
[…] moral of this myth could be also linked to Plato´s analogy of the divided line, in which the Sun symbolizes the highest Form (Idea of God). Therefore according to this […]
🙂 Un abrazo…
Reblogged this on That Dark Alley.
Thanks for sharing this post on your blog, Aquileana 🙂
Thanks @mesreflexions for sharing this post at Twitter,
Aquileana 🙂
[…] Image Credit: Amalia Pedemont, La Audacia de Aquiles […]
Aquileana – reading this post reminds me about the days I was a young university student. I was very rebellious, and I didn’t want to let the prisoners down just because Plato says so:) My idea was – they don’t have to guess anything. They have to let their imagination fly and invent the world:)
My best to you, sweet girl!:)
What wonderful personal memories to brought to me today. I am glad that you were that way, We really need more people who want to set free from their own chains and get out off the cave, while showing the path to others prisioners, dear Inese.
Thank you, my blogger friend. All my best wishes to you, as well.
Aquileana 😛
So true! Thank you for the knowledge you share on your blog!
My best wishes,
Inese
Interesting, I see the connections you mentioned to me now! Thanks for sharing! 😀
And thank you for taking time to read and comment dear Ry!… I´ll be at your blog ASAP.
Sending you all my best wishes. Happy New Year!. Aquileana 😀
[…] The Theory of Forms maintains that two distinct levels of reality exist: the visible world of sights and sounds that we inhabit and the intelligible world of Forms that stands above the visible world and gives it being. For example, Plato maintains that in addition to being able to identify a beautiful person or a beautiful painting, we also have a general conception of Beauty itself, and we are able to identify the beauty in a person or a painting only because we have this conception of Beauty in the abstract. In other words, the beautiful things we can see are beautiful only because they participate in the more general Form of Beauty. This Form of Beauty is itself invisible, eternal, and unchanging, unlike the things in the visible world that can grow old and lose their beauty. […]
[…] its incarnation in the body, was in the realm of the “Forms”. There, the soul saw the Essences-Forms or Ideas, rather than the pale shadows or copies we merely experience on earth. Hence, when we identify an […]
Reblogged this on lampmagician.
Thanks so much for reblogging… I just saw the trackback! 😉 Your support is much appreciated. Have a great weekend. ⭐
[…] Allegory of the Cave is written as a dialogue between Plato’s teacher Socrates and Plato’s brother Glaucon at the […]
The allegory of the cave; we want to escape and do, but we know that we will have to return and we always will.
Interesting and quite accurate thoughts… Thanks so much for dropping by and for your comment… Best wishes, 🌟🌞
[…] The duplication and proliferation of copies might allude to Plato´s Theory of Forms. […]
[…] Source: https://aquileana.wordpress.com/2014/04/03/platos-republic-the-allegory-of-the-cave-and-the-analogy-… […]
[…] his dialogue “Phaedrus”; Plato denies the legitimacy of the written word as capable of conveying knowledge in any truly […]
[…] Plato intentionally ignored it, keeping it aside in his Gnoseological Theory. In turn, he enthroned the discursive Episteme, clearly much more acceptable to him, as he considered that Episteme was related to the highest degree of Knowledge. […]
[…] Combined theory of Allegory of the Cave and the Analogy of the Divided Line on Aquileana.com https://aquileana.wordpress.com/2014/04/03/platos-republic-the-allegory-of-the-cave-and-the-analogy-… […]
Thanks for linking back to my post…. Sending best wishes 🙂
[…] moral of this myth could be also linked to Plato´s analogy of the divided line, in which the Sun symbolizes the highest Form (Idea of God). Therefore according to this […]
[…] his famous “Allegory of Cave”, Aristotle explained how what is real isn’t ideal. What is ideal, is an idea. Things exist in […]